Relationship vines 2014 june

relationship vines 2014 june

Tim Keller, June Vines, Matthew, God and the Gay Christian: The Biblical Case in Support of Same Sex Relationships, Convergent Books, Wilson. Jun 7, Monte Vines sits at his desk at his home with a copy of his son Matthew's book, “ God and the Gay Christian,” on Thursday. (June 5, ) The. Campos and Vines, “Angola and China: A Pragmatic Relationship,” 3. sign Cooperation Deals,” China Daily, June 10, , accessed August 12,

Loader is the most prominent expert on ancient and biblical views of sexuality, having written five large and two small volumes in his lifetime. Re-categorizing same sex relations. A third line of reasoning in these volumes and others like them involves recategorization.

In the past, homosexuality was categorized by all Christian churches and theology as sin.

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However, many argue that homosexuality should be put in the same category as slavery and segregation. Vines writes, for example, that the Bible supported slavery and that most Christians used to believe that some form of slavery was condoned by the Bible, but we have now come to see that all slavery is wrong.

relationship vines 2014 june

Therefore, just as Christians interpreted the Bible to support segregation and slavery until times changed, so Christians should change their interpretations about homosexuality as history moves forward.

Most Protestants in Canada and Britain and many in the northern U. Rodney Stark For the Glory of God, points out that the Catholic church also came out early against the African slave trade. He proves that even before the Supreme Court decisions of the mids, almost no one was promoting the slender and forced biblical justifications for racial superiority and segregation.

Even otherwise racist theologians and ministers could not find a basis for white supremacy in the Bible. Up until very recently, all Christian churches and theologians unanimously read the Bible as condemning homosexuality. By contrast, there was never any consensus or even a majority of churches that thought slavery and segregation were supported by the Bible. David Chappell shows that even within the segregationist South, efforts to support racial separation from the Bible collapsed within a few years.

Does anyone really think that within a few years from now there will be no one willing to defend the traditional view of sexuality from biblical texts? The answer is surely no. This negates the claim that the number, strength, and clarity of those biblical texts supposedly supporting slavery and those texts condemning homosexuality are equal, and equally open to changed interpretations.

Wilson puts forward a different form of the recategorization argument when he says the issue of same-sex relations in the church is like issues of divorce and remarriage, Christian participation in war, or the use of in vitro fertilization. Wilson, Vines, and many others argue that same-sex relations must now be put into this category. However history shows that same-sex relations do not belong in this category, either.

There have always been substantial parts of the church that came to different positions on these issues. But until very, very recently, there had been complete unanimity about homosexuality in the church across all centuries, cultures, and even across major divisions of the Orthodox, Roman Catholic, and Protestant traditions.

Josh Clark - Vines Compilation February/2017

So homosexuality is categorically different. One has to ask, then, why is it the case that literally no church, theologian, or Christian thinker or movement ever thought that any kind of same sex relationships was allowable until now?

One answer to the question is an ironic one. During the Civil War, British Presbyterian biblical scholars told their southern American colleagues who supported slavery that they were reading the Scriptural texts through cultural blinders. They wanted to find evidence for their views in the Bible and voila — they found it.

relationship vines 2014 june

If no Christian reading the Bible — across diverse cultures and times — ever previously discovered support for same-sex relationships in the Bible until today, it is hard not to wonder if many now have new cultural spectacles on, having a strong predisposition to find in these texts evidence for the views they already hold.

What are those cultural spectacles? These narratives have been well analyzed by scholars such as Robert Bellah and Charles Taylor. They are beliefs about the nature of reality that are not self-evident to most societies and they carry no more empirical proof than any other religious beliefs. They are also filled with inconsistencies and problems. Both Vines and Wilson largely assume these cultural narratives.

It is these faith assumptions about identity and freedom that make the straightforward reading of the biblical texts seem so wrong to them. They are the underlying reason for their views, but they are never identified or discussed. Vines argues that while the Levitical code forbids homosexuality Leviticus Here Vines is rejecting the New Testament understanding that the ceremonial laws of Moses around the sacrificial system and ritual purity were fulfilled in Christ and no longer binding, but that the moral law of the Old Testament is still in force.

This view has been accepted by all branches of the church since New Testament times.

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When Vines refuses to accept this ancient distinction between the ceremonial and moral law, he is doing much more than simply giving us an alternative interpretation of the Old Testament — he is radically revising what biblical authority means. That decisively shifts the ultimate authority to define right and wrong onto the individual Christian and away from the biblical text.

The traditional view is this: Yes, there are things in the Bible that Christians no longer have to follow but, if the Scripture is our final authority, it is only the Bible itself that can tell us what those things are.

The prohibitions against homosexuality are re-stated in the New Testament Romans 1, 1 Corinthians 6, 1 Timothy 1 but Jesus himself Mark 7as well as the rest of the New Testament, tells us that the clean laws and ceremonial code is no longer in force.

relationship vines 2014 june

Vines asserts that he maintains a belief in biblical authority, but with arguments like this one he is actually undermining it. This represents a massive shift in historic Christian theology and life. Being on the wrong side of history. Charles Taylor, however, explains how this idea of inevitable historical progress developed out of the Enlightenment optimism about human nature and reason.

The entire society was constructed around patriarchy and the superiority of men over women. Every, as in all, references to same-sex behavior in the Bible is within a context of: Brown, can you cite me any 1st century texts that refers to long term, committed, same-sex relationships? I did not come in with Greek resources. Somewhere, there should be a nice love story between two men that mirrors what we see in same-sex relationships today. Phaedrus, the main character, in the work, is praising pederasty.

A sexual relationship purely based in lust and power between a man and a young boy. They may have fallen in love eventually, but this was not dating.

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Jesus lived in a time and culture where loving equal male-male relationship were a non-issue. There really are things more important than who has sex with whom.

We have been told, with great assurance, in fact Dr. Nope, he was writing about sexual lust and unequal male-boy relationships that were quite common at the time. We could ride the party line on this issue and continue to force gay people out of churches, tell them they must change orientation, or demand they be celibate in order to see the Kingdom of heaven.